Curse

SleepeR · Apr 23, 2005, 02:43 PM // 14:43

I've been reading forums a little bit now and you three seem to post alot in Mesmer/x builds. You guys obviously know a vast more than i do and i'd like to know your opinions and critiques on this build. I also put in probably the two most skills a few of you would consider "unplayable", WW and MW. I'm trying to make these skills as most useful as possible.

Mesmer/X - Single target energy denial using WW and MW.
Domination-12+X
Inspiration-12+X
X-X?
BackFire
Diversion
Energy Burn
Mind Wrack
Power Leak
Wastrels Worry
Energy Drain
Ether Feast

So the point of this build is to drain a single targets energy to 0 using the allotted energy draining skills. While at the same time they're taking some damage. When their energy is 0 i'll put on WW every 3 seconds to trigger the damage dealt after that ammount of time. Seeing as how they'll have 0 energy they can't really cast skills at all or useful skills so the damage will be un-avoidable. When they regen energy theres Energy Feast to remove a small ammount of their energy while at the same time healing me for whatever i lost. I could also add in an energy degen skill so if they do hit 0 i'll trigger that so they stay at 0. I know some of you will say "Why cause energy deduction on one target when you can on 2-3?" Well this is not an 8v8 competitive GvG but it's a fun 4v4,6v6 build for pvp. Suggestions? I'd also like to get into Mesmer energy denial builds more extensively so if we could talk via AIM or MSN that would work great.

Nash · Apr 23, 2005, 02:47 PM // 14:47

If you want their advice, why don't you take it?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackace

Lesson 3: Wastrels Worry, Mind Wrack, Wither, and Soul Barbs are pretty bad. Combining WW and SB, or WW and Backfire, or any MW/WW combinations exponentially multiply their horrible natures.

tektonik · Apr 23, 2005, 05:24 PM // 17:24

Issues: You can't rely on mind wrack to do damage at best it is a cover hex to prevent BF removal. Ensign would have said Malaise was better last month but I don't know if he has a different opinion now other than they nerfed malaise and he is sad.

Your energy denial skills, only 3, are not going to be able to drain someone to 0 on their own anyways. This means BF + 2 interupts are still your only means of locking down a caster. Might want to rethink that.

I disagree with blackace. WW is one of those skills that looks bad on paper but does pretty decent in PvP as a DD for a mesmer. WW will do no damage if a skill ENDS before 3 seconds and I found it did a pretty good job.

Last note I wouldn't suggest calling specific people out to help. You can come on IRC and ask questions when ensign and the like are on but otherwise we disagree on some things, WW for instance. Oh and I am the village idiot...i think...right nash? lawlz

lessthan3

Ensign · Apr 23, 2005, 05:26 PM // 17:26

It's a build for arena? Sure, why not. I'm not a huge critic of Mind Wrack and Wastrel's Worry there - teams aren't organized enough for you to count on, the opponents generally don't have multiple Monks, and the costs you incur by babysitting one target just don't come into play. So, why not, play an energy denial build with a couple mediocre damage spells because there aren't better options.

Now in organized PvP? Please live up to the power of your class by shutting down or otherwise harassing multiple targets instead of trying to do an Air Elementalist impression with 5 point Energy Drains.

Peace,
-CxE

Nash · Apr 23, 2005, 05:32 PM // 17:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by tektonik

...but does pretty decent in PvP as a DD for a mesmer.

DD, on a Mesmer? You feel the need to have DD in all your builds? :/

tektonik · Apr 23, 2005, 05:34 PM // 17:34

nope but if someone wanted to do damage this is a good way to get it. Never commented on how useful damage on a mesmer was. Which IMO is average because you could do much worse and you could do better use of a mesmer.

FireMarshal · Apr 23, 2005, 05:40 PM // 17:40

Why are people knocking Mind Wrack? Its rather decent IMO. You do a sizable chunk of damage for only 5e. Its a great side bonus for any anti-caster build. Just keep an eye on your target and if they are spamming something, chances are they are low on energy. Use your own energy denial skills to help Mind Wrack along.

tektonik · Apr 23, 2005, 05:46 PM // 17:46

the condition for MW is happens for .3 seconds at most and takes another spell at least to get it there again.

FireMarshal · Apr 23, 2005, 05:49 PM // 17:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by tektonik

the condition for MW is happens for .3 seconds at most and takes another spell at least to get it there again.

I didnt understand that sentence.

SleepeR · Apr 23, 2005, 05:50 PM // 17:50

This build is completely situational as you can see, Ensign is right how its a good build for arena pug but for organized play i never thought of such a thing with this. This is my fun build for when the time is right to slaughter upon newbies,

tektonik · Apr 23, 2005, 05:58 PM // 17:58

the condition for which mind wrack works is 0 energy. The window for that is extremely small because regen is always working. So if mind wrack is triggered and you cast it again you have to use another skill to bring them back to 0. There are just so many better ways to do this especially since this build is going to have a hard time bringing anyone to 0

FireMarshal · Apr 23, 2005, 06:17 PM // 18:17

Well, I was thinking along the lines of Mind Wrack+Debibilating Shot.

Apr 23, 2005, 07:25 PM // 19:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by FireMarshal

Why are people knocking Mind Wrack? Its rather decent IMO. You do a sizable chunk of damage for only 5e. Its a great side bonus for any anti-caster build. Just keep an eye on your target and if they are spamming something, chances are they are low on energy. Use your own energy denial skills to help Mind Wrack along.

Doesnt work that way at all vs people that know what they are doing. I dont know how many times I was playing last BWE and saw the MW spam and watch it never go off. Once you understand how energy management,focus switching and MW works you'll realize its a piece of shit.

tektonik · Apr 23, 2005, 07:30 PM // 19:30

yeah Wither + Malaise looks nice until you can switch to a no +en weapon and focus and get rid of them.

FireMarshal · Apr 23, 2005, 07:30 PM // 19:30

Quote:

focus switching

I understand that, but tons of other people dont

Apr 23, 2005, 07:34 PM // 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by FireMarshal

I understand that, but tons of other people dont

so whats the point of calling skills good that only work on bad players?

tektonik · Apr 23, 2005, 09:53 PM // 21:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackace

so whats the point of calling skills good that only work on bad players?

ummmm...wait....I know this......gimme a sec.....There Isn't!!!!!!

FireMarshal · Apr 23, 2005, 10:01 PM // 22:01

My point is, use a build until people figure out how to defeat it, and create another one until people defeat that one. Bah, stop over analyzing, people

Right now, not everyone knows about the Focus Switch. Until they figure it out or learn about it, MW is a decent skill. When that happens, and it will, just adapt. I know you guys are all smart enough to know this...obviously I should never have even posted this stuff.

Bottom line, MW is not a bad skill, sure its not single handedly going to take down opposing players, but its nice to have. Just because some people dont like a skill doesnt mean others have to not like it.

Apr 23, 2005, 10:13 PM // 22:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by FireMarshal

My point is, use a build until people figure out how to defeat it, and create another one until people defeat that one. Bah, stop over analyzing, people

Right now, not everyone knows about the Focus Switch. Until they figure it out or learn about it, MW is a decent skill. When that happens, and it will, just adapt. I know you guys are all smart enough to know this...obviously I should never have even posted this stuff.

Bottom line, MW is not a bad skill, sure its not single handedly going to take down opposing players, but its nice to have. Just because some people dont like a skill doesnt mean others have to not like it.

Im not over analyzing, I'm arguing from the p.o.v. of someone trying to win vs good players. If you like beating up scrubs then of course Mind Wrack, along with a bunch of other skills start to look good.

Using a build until people figure out how to defeat it is very good logic and a core element to competitive play. However, the knowledge of how to beat Mind Wrack builds are somewhat out there and dont require alot of thought.

We try to educate people on how to go about breaking bad skills apart and becoming better players though. I'm not saying this though as if Im trying to be harsh towards you, but more along the lines of something that needs to be stated for those out there(especially some alpha testers) that need to know better.

Galatea Orea · Apr 24, 2005, 06:06 AM // 06:06

I would love to know what a Focus Switch is, but I'm afraid to ask.